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I wonder if I could get some information from you.

2
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I'm a reporter at Sacramento Bee newspaper and they give your number down here.

3
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It's a police station to people calling to report UFOs.

4
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Yes.

5
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At the Sheriff's Office here they give a number in Southern California,

6
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another place called the UFO Education Center,

7
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and they give you a look up a story on who runs the places and so forth.

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Are you a private outfit?

9
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Yes we are.

10
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Are you a nonprofit type organization?

11
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Are you just one of the staff there? Are you a charge member?

12
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I'm not a staff, yes.

13
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I wonder, can you tell me a little bit about it?

14
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Sure.

15
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How busy you are and how busy you've been recently.

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Have you been in a call from down in the Sacramento or Northern California area?

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Okay, well things have been rather quiet really for several years and up until about,

18
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well, morning before last I guess, when everything broke loose in California.

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And we had several calls from the Sacramento Stockton area, also from Orange County and Los Angeles County.

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Our calls were pretty frequent from about 3 a.m. right through to about 7 a.m. that morning,

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that would be the morning of the 22nd.

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Okay, well in the Los Angeles and Orange County area there were two very brilliant objects moving across the sky,

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from Southwest to Northeast, they were flying in tandem at what was described by some of the helicopter passers,

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about medium altitude, comparing it with aircraft flights,

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and they were flying in a horizontal flight trajectory, high rate of speed,

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and then they just, they didn't fade out, they didn't burn out, they just clicked out,

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just like turning off the light, and they did not leave a trail like a meteor would.

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They couldn't really explain it, they said it was quite spectacular, a lot of people saw that,

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and then up around the San Joaquin Valley area, or San Joaquin County area,

30
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around 5.15, there were more reports from police,

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specifically sheriffs, cars that observed for about 15 minutes two brilliant white objects maneuvering over the Sierra Nevada mountain range.

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They were not stationary, they were definitely on the move, just moving around, performing some crazy maneuvers and so forth.

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And we also had another call from the Colusa area, where a couple, around 3.23 in the morning,

34
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saw a huge disc shaped object ring with blue lights moving from Southwest to Northeast.

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That's about all we had for that particular morning, and then of course we have a few other scattered reports from around the country,

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we just didn't amount to anything.

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What, does your center get into interpretation of these things, do you just log these,

38
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or what do you do after you get some information?

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No, when we complete the investigation on any case, we evaluate the information,

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run it through a data reduction system, take that and catalog it into the data bank,

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and then this information is compared with past reports, specifically the unknowns for the past 20 years to see how they compare.

42
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And then of course this massive data which is accumulated is used in our various research programs.

43
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How do these recent things compare with, what has been reported in the past really similar?

44
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Well, okay, they come in three different categories, they've got the disc shaped object which is very,

45
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it's right into the description category for that particular type of object,

46
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and then the one in Central California where the two lights were maneuvering around, this is very common.

47
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The only problem there is all the witnesses see is a light, they don't see any superstructure of any kind of a vehicle.

48
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Then the ones that passed over Southern California why, this is quite common for rapid over flights,

49
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and what we refer to as high flyers, which cannot be or do not fit into the category of meteor flights.

50
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Okay, so we offer them two different patterns that you've been reported in the past.

51
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Right.

52
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Okay, what do you do with the information after you've focused that down on the data with the past?

53
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Is it for any immediate use, for it to anybody, or what do you do with the stuff after you've evaluated it?

54
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Okay, well that depends on the priority of the type of case.

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If it's a real close approach case or a landing, why then we try to get a field investigator in and do all the on the spot investigations that they can do.

56
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But the data itself is used in, we have constant research projects going, we make a very close study of the behavior pattern of these objects,

57
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and specifically in relation to the witness.

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Then we watch for changes in patterns such as the type of vehicles that are being seen, where the activity is concentrated, what they might be watching.

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If they get a heavy rash or reports from a specific area, then we try to determine just exactly what they're doing there, what the purpose is.

60
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The type of surface features that they might be checking on or geological studies of some kind, or are they watching people or certain people.

61
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But we try to watch for these patterns, these patterns have formed in the past and we just watch for repeats as well.

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I suppose it's to say whether these researches are fighting to amount to or give evaluation to them or interpretation or has them.

63
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It's a little early yet, we're still gathering data, we're searching for more witnesses.

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I think that the one up in the north, the northern part of California would fall very well into the UFO category, or we would classify it as an unknown because the actual vehicle itself was seen.

65
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You can print many of those?

66
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Yes, yes we do.

67
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I wonder if I could ask you just a little bit about the organization and the structure of it.

68
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Sure.

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How are you set up, are you funded by donations or what do you get there operating?

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No, we have a permanent staff of 12 volunteers and they foot all the bills, they just split it up.

71
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It's self-funded, we don't have to rely on anyone, there's no strings attached to the organization, we're free to operate in whatever direction we want to go.

72
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And these volunteers also may end the center and do all the book work on the various research projects.

73
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That's interesting. How long have you been in operation?

74
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Well the center itself has been in operation for about two and a half years.

75
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Apparently you've got the word out fairly well since as I said at the place down here, for refer calls to you, you don't specifically have other leads or sheriff officers who have been to California such as perhaps Calusa, is that one of the ones that's on your list?

76
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Yes, we were notified by the Calusa Sheriff's Department.

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There are a few, we don't know exactly how many but we know that there are some.

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We have sent out some literature, spot mailings in hopes that they would cooperate as well.

79
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And that's all we can hope for.

80
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I see, that's what brings the context to you.

81
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Right, this is our effort to make contact with the people who have these experiences.

82
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I suppose that's why the county sheriff's office here asks people to contact the one in Southern California.

83
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It's probably just something that came in the mail from a post to the other or something else like that.

84
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You say it's been really quiet for the last couple of years.

85
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Do these things tend to run in cycles such as the one you just had several over a one or two day period?

86
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Is that the way things tend to go and then nothing for a while?

87
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Well, off and on, yes.

88
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Let me put it this way, there's no marked pattern.

89
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The last large rash of UFO reports occurred in 73.

90
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It's just been tapering off continuously since then now with periodic spurts of reports here and there, like from California.

91
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But when we have what we call a flap condition or a sudden activity which goes on for maybe weeks in a particular given area,

92
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why then we keep track of all this and try to see if there's a marked pattern between that and the last one and the previous one and so forth.

93
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But we have not found such a pattern and we don't have an answer as to why it's the way it is.

94
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We've tried to compare close planet oppositions and various astronomical positions of solar systems and so forth in comparison to ours.

95
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We just haven't found any marked pattern of any kind.

96
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So their reason for coming and going is just completely unknown.

97
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One of the things that the people down in San Diego County, Southern California, told me was that, of course they're convinced that these are research flights from other places in space,

98
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but they seem to be convinced that these flights are originating from within our solar system.

99
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Is that one of the premises you're operating on or does anybody have to feel that way?

100
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No, no. Considering the probes that NASA has made into the solar system, we're quite sure that the ports of origin are not from our system.

101
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I mean we could be wrong on this but we're going by what NASA has come up with, actual data.

102
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And so we feel that if they are interplanetary, then they are probably coming from other solar systems, nearby solar systems,

103
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and if you really want to get out way out in the right field, we could even imagine that they would be coming in from other galaxies.

104
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Of course the astronomers, you know, they put up a big fight against such a theory because of the tremendous mileage involved in distances.

105
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But our science is very, very young and who is to say that we will not develop means of travel that could cover those distances in practically no time at all.

106
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You operate on the premise that these are some sort of origins of discovery from other places or some sort of research or some sort of study missions.

107
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These means you're just going to take a look at here, maybe do the equivalent of photograph or study it or something of this sort.

108
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How do the people in your group view what they've learned so far?

109
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Well, of course these sightings have been made for thousands of years and we feel that there's a constant program being carried on by alien visitors from many ports of origin

110
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and that some may be just flybys and come in just out of curiosity, others may be conducting constant surveillance of the advancement of mankind on this planet.

111
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But we do feel that there is a definite purpose. When they come here, they appear just by their behavior pattern to be here for a purpose.

112
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We have seen in our various research projects that there appears to be various levels of technology involved.

113
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We feel that some of the visitors are more advanced through science and technology than others.

114
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We've made a very close study of the various types of vehicles and the types of apparent propulsion systems that they're using and it's obvious that more are more sophisticated than others.

115
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Have you ever gotten any reports of actual sightings by witnesses of the inhabitants of any of these crafts?

116
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No, the occupants? No, we haven't.

117
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So these cameras are made just a little bit out of distance to avoid people at least to the point where they can see what was going on, who was inside and so forth.

118
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Does this give people problems that are looking for ways to explain this?

119
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In other words, if we set a probe to Mars and a man probe or something and discovered light there would probably make some attempt to get out and look at it under a magnifying glass.

120
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A lot of people say, well why don't they get out and shake hands with us or take a picture of us or something so we can see them.

121
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Is this a hard thing to explain?

122
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Not really. It used to be, but we've come up with, the mystery isn't what it was five years ago as far as we're concerned because we've come up with a lot of information on our research.

123
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We feel that the problem of contact between aliens and earth people involves magnetic, bio-magnetics, evolution.

124
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We feel that there's an evolutionary gap. In other words, any race of people who are highly involved, let's say five or ten thousand years beyond us,

125
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I don't think there's going to be any comparison relating to their physical and mental development compared to ours.

126
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Our science is finding the human body has a regular bio-magnetic system associated with a biological clock.

127
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They're just getting into this, they don't know too much about it, but they know that it's there.

128
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We feel that any alien being who is far advanced beyond us in evolution, that their bio-system, the magnetic system, the biological clock and the whole bit cannot blend with ours.

129
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Or communicate with us.

130
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There could be a communication problem also.

131
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Now there have been claims where individuals have said they have made contact.

132
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Now we can believe part of these because we believe that there are some people on this planet who are much more advanced through this biological system than others and they may be able to make contact.

133
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We also believe that the system that controls or makes these vehicles move also involves magnetic fields of some kind, which if they come into contact with the bio-magnetic system around the human body,

134
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could be either fatal or cause serious injuries.

135
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And this we feel is one of the reasons that there are very few close approaches to witnesses when we compare the number of sightings that have actually been made.

136
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But it's a new science, I'm speaking of our regular orthodox field now, it's a new science and they're making some very mind-boggling discoveries in this.

137
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And we feel this definitely has something to do with the UFOs.

138
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Do you have a system there at your center of the kind of, oh I don't know what you'd call it, but some sort of grading system that you, when you get a report of a sighting of a UFO that you can give a certain amount of credence to it.

139
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Is there some way you can verify it or how do you determine which calls are strictly based on nothing other than some of these imaginations?

140
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In which ones do you tend to give more relief in?

141
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In other words, if you get one from an Air Force pilot or something, do you tend to give it a little bit more, I think it's a little more substantial than when you might get from somebody who sounds like he's a half-gassed or something?

142
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Oh yes, yes, we would naturally give more priority to qualified observers, but this doesn't mean that a farmer out in the country couldn't come up with something just as valid.

143
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Because when an individual calls in, and within about the first minute or two of that individual describing what they have seen, we can just about tell whether it's a hope's call or not.

144
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The descriptions are just completely outside of the ordinary, light descriptions, but when they start describing vehicles and they can see superstructure and so forth, we know what to look for in their description.

145
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If they have a very, very good background in the subject of UFOs, then they could perpetrate a hope without any problem.

146
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But we have found that at least 95% of the people that report objects to us are diehard non-believers. They have never had any interest in the subject and they know nothing about it.

147
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So when somebody calls up and they've got a quivering voice and they've had hell-scared out of them and they start describing something that fits right into the category of all the data that we've collected, then we can be sure that the report is valid.

148
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And then of course this is backed up by field investigators making non-spot investigations too.

149
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How do you field check something here? Just for credit with the service of you? Maybe check with law enforcement people or something that came out of people who called me in there?

150
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How do you go about it?

151
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Well, whoever goes out to do the interviewing will, depending upon where the individual lives, they'll check the neighborhoods and check with the news media and check with law enforcement and anybody else, any other agency that might have got a call, they'll go to them and check it out.

152
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One of the main things is to get as many witnesses to any one incident that we can.

153
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Do you have someone managing your phone there 24 hours a day?

154
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Yes, sir. This phone is answered by one of our staff around the clock. There's no answering machines, there's no telephone answering service qualified and very experienced people are here at all times.

155
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Our question, are the people who are the volunteers, are they specialized in any particular field themselves as far as jobs or locations or are they just people who are interested in you?

156
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Well, they've all got a great interest in and background in the subject. We have a physicist and there's a professional astronomer and we have an MD and then there's a couple people associated with electronics and the rest are just ordinary laymen.

157
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How about yourself, what do you do?

158
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No, I'm retired.

159
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Do you have any records on the number of calls you have gotten from Northern California over the years today?

160
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Well, maybe I should ask you this, how large an area do you get calls from?

161
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Well, just the west coast primarily.

162
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Do they come in the other way of knowing how frequent the calls from Northern California are in comparatles with other areas?

163
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Well, I couldn't give you a definite answer. Let me put it this way that we have probably have more calls, well since the center has opened I'll say we've had more calls from Northern California than any other area of the west.

164
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Does that mean anything to you in terms of your research?

165
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Well, we've gone over that quite a bit and there's been some personal interpretations as some people feel that it could have something to do with many of the air bases down there and then there's a theory that they may be watching or a certain faction of these vehicles may be watching the earthquake fault zones.

166
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There's all kinds of theories.

167
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In an article I can use your phone number and say that someone can call at any hour of the day and expect to talk to somebody who really knows you at Bose.

168
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Yes, absolutely.

169
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And be interested in what takes down the information.

170
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Yes, there's somebody here at all times.

171
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Okay, good. I really appreciate the information and I'll pass it on to our readers.

172
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Okay, thank you.

173
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Okay, thank you very much.

174
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You bet.